I think because I’d been there before I was a bit more confident about what to expect and, because people had, you know, because various doctors or midwives or what-have-you at the ante-natal appointments had made, you know, they’d all looked at the notes and asked me about how, you know, about [daughter’s name] birth. And the doctor, I think it was the consultant who had said’ I’m pretty sure it was the consultant who had said that there was no way that they would let me labour for as long as I’d, you know, he said, ‘We wouldn’t let you labour for as long as you did with your first child anyway’, and I think that was quite significant, because I just, you know, the first time I was there, I was in labour at home the whole day and then I was in labour in the hospital for, you know, nearly twenty-four hours as well before they finally decided that they were going to give me a section.

I saw a midwife and I made a very strong bond with one of the midwives in the team and she regularly sort of supported me. And she was on the phone as well, if I needed to talk. Because there was an additional thing as well that they wanted me to have a section for. Because my baby on the scan – I can’t remember was it the thirty-six week scan… Looked as though she was going to be quite big and her head circumference was smaller than her shoulder, I think. So there was a risk of shoulder dystocia, I think it is’ yeah’

So I had two risks’ having another section and the possibility of the shoulders getting stuck. And my midwife was very supportive over the idea of VBAC, she would come home, come into my home and talk to me and reassure me about any issues, and, at times when I was having these negotiations with the consultant, you know, I found it quite difficult because I had to be very strong and she was there as a supporting network saying, ‘Yes, you can do this’ and ‘Well be there for you. And actually this midwife delivered me, wanted to deliver me and she ended up working a night shift to deliver me, she was feeling that strongly about my need to deliver naturally.

So she was a very, very strong supporting influence for me, which made a huge difference.

And from the outset, you’ve had a preference about how you want to deliver this time, you’ve wanted to go for an elective section?

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

And that’s been from the beginning, and’

Yeah, well, even from when we were trying to conceive. And as I said, I was, I was completely certain that I would get the elected caesarean.

And at no point have you changed your mind?

No. When I went for my twenty week scan’ I was speaking to the, to the consultant and he was trying to put, put off my decision. But’ even just talking about it with him, even just, that, that slightest, slightest doubt that I might not be allowed to have an elected caesarean just really agitated me at the time and I just said – I said, ‘No, I’m not leaving here ’til I’ve got the date plan.

And do you feel that you’ve had the right quality of information for you this time?

Yeah. The only thing is, at the time when the decision was actually made… the doctor that saw me – I felt that it could have’ which is probably a good thing, but it wasn’t particularly a discussion. It was more, ‘Have you thought about what you want to do?’ ‘That’s fine… I agree with that’,…and that was sort of it. It wasn’t a sort of real two way process.

So they didn’t really give you enough information for you to make a really informed decision, or they didn’t really discuss it?

They sort of did that afterwards. It was a bit of a… you know, literally… “What do you want to do?” And then when I said I was thinking about this [caesarean], they said, “Right, well, we’ll just have to outline…” Almost as if it was read out… “This will happen”, “You need to bear in mind this, that, and the other”. But it was not exactly rushed but it was sort of just a sort of practiced’

All day?

Yeah.

And what about the relevance of the information, do you feel that it was tailored enough to your own needs?

Yeah.

And the timing? Because you said before about the timing of the decision, do you think you’d have liked that earlier do you think?

I would have probably liked a chat with a doctor earlier on… but it wasn’t essential. I think in a way you get a lot of pressure from family and friends as well and part of me wanted to know so that I could stop them asking me what I was going to do.

I’ve wanted someone to tell me what the right option is really. But nobody-, obviously the doctors and midwife, they, they don’t really necessarily recommend which one. They, they keep saying, ‘It’s up to you, it’s up to you’ and giving me the benefits and the- the risks, so I’m still sort of thinking, ‘Oh, is it all down to me? Am I going to make the right one?’ Whereas if somebody said, ‘We think you should do this’, I would go by that.

And how have you got on with your midwife in this pregnancy?

Fine. Yeah, yeah.

Has she been able to answer any of your questions?

Yeah, I mean, we only discussed birth plan-wise yesterday, and she didn’t really seem concerned about having’ attempting for a normal delivery. And I’ve had a few talks with the consultant at the hospital and, it’s the same really, they, they’re not really concerned either way.

Right. How do you feel about that? About that they’re not worried. Has that made you less worried?

Not really, because I sort of think they don’t understand that I am worried, if you see what I mean.

Yeah, I do. ‘So you’ve been able to discuss your fears and your expectations have you, this time?

A little bit, a little bit, yeah.

So how involved do you want to be in the decision, because it sounds from what you’ve been saying like you want them to make the decision for you?

Yeah, yeah.

Why do you think you want them to tell you?

Because I think they’ve had a lot more experience with this, and I know they say the percentages on the risks and everything, but I just think it – from a medical opinion I think it would be better if they took reign and said, ‘This is what you should do.

I just wish that the midwives were more open-minded and would talk about both sides more. You know, about your options because… Had I not had to have a section beforehand with my first child, then theres no way in the world I’d have even contemplated having one. But having gone through it before and knowing, reading about all the risks of even trying for a trial of labour, I weighed up the risks and the benefits, particularly through using the decision analysis and decided that [a caesarean] was the best option for me. When you – you can almost see, without them actually saying it, you can see it in their eyes when you tell them. When I was in hospital that day, I was thirty-eight weeks pregnant and I went in because I’d had contractions, then they said to me, ‘Oh, you know, what decision have you come to?’ And I said, ‘Oh I’m booked in for actually a section the following week. You could see it in their faces, that theres almost a look of disapproval. And when I actually went in, I think it was for my five month scan, and a couple of the midwives said to me then, ‘Have you made a decision?’ and I said, ‘No, I haven’t made a decision yet. They said, ‘Oh well, you don’t need to make a decision yet, and why don’t you just have a trial of labour and if it gets too much or if’, I think one of them said, ‘If it gets too much or if there are any complications then you can have an emergency section. So they’re very keen to push you down that route, very keen. And another study that I took, took part in, the midwife that came round for that, she was really nice. But again, she was saying that nowadays they wouldn’t automatically offer you a section if your child was breech, they’ll turn the baby now and you know, “It’s all old wives’ tales about the chances of you having a rupture if you go into labour are really slim”, and “We really actively encourage you now to have a [trial of labour]. You’ve got a really high chance of having a normal labour and a normal delivery”. So she was really pushing that. And at that point I’d not kind of made my mind up, so I felt like she was really trying to push me down that road.

Why do you think that is?

Honestly? [Mm] Cost to the NHS. I think that a planned, an elective caesarean section, they have to have so many people in that room. It’s, it’s a huge cost to the NHS, whereas if they can get as many people as possible through VBAC, less, whilst you still have to have a midwife, and I think they have to have two other people there because of previous caesarean section, theres, obviously theres a lesser cost. And also it keeps their figures down, because I think [Hospital] have got quite high figures with regards to caesarean sections, so they’re trying to keep the figures down. That’s the honest answer.