To, that they too can persevere, even though they’sve got mental health difficulties they can preserve not to feel embarrassed of their mental health difficulties, that to continue with life and to keep on working at what they’sre doing and not to be taken, not to let anyone pull them down because I think that if you let that happen then what will happen is that you’sll go down and it will affect you really badly. But if you persevere and if you ignore those ignorant comments you will persevere in life and I feel that I’sve persevered. Even though I haven’st got a PhD yet I think I’sve persevered and I’sve shown people that through my experience I’sve positively done things constructive in my life that a lot of people can learn from and a lot of people can adopt to their own lifestyle.

Bill Clinton once famously said that mental illness is not something to be ashamed of but stigma and bias shames us all. And he’s absolutely right, he got it spot on, straight away because he said, On the one hand we shouldn’st be ashamed, patients shouldn’st be ashamed that they’sve got a mental health difficulty, irrespective of if there are sensitivities or not in their community they should feel proud that, you know, they’sve experienced mental health difficulties but that’s part of life you shouldn’st be embarrassed of it, if you suffer from it don’st be embarrassed.

Well, yeah well the worse one is, and that’s why I was, talking about keeping the windows open because I still have anxiety issues. whenever I’m in a heated place I get very anxious, whenever I’m in a crowded place I get anxious, whenever I’m on a bus I get anxious, whenever I’m on a tube I get anxious, whenever I’m in a car I get anxious. Wherever I am where there’s people, where it’s hot I get anxious, I get sweaty I get, that makes me very uncomfortable, it makes me very conscious of the people around me, it makes me very alert, you know, and I see people as a threat rather than people that are trying to, who are my relatives or whatever and that makes me distance myself away from everyone, walk out the house or stand outside or whatever and exclude myself from everyone else. That’s some of the, that’s one of the experiences that I’sve had and I’m not sure about the other ones, I can’st remember because of the medication again, a lot of, you know, the medication blocks a lot out so, what was the question again?

I was asking about what effect your symptoms have on your life?

Yes well they have, I think they have the most significant impact on my life because it affects my day to day life of going out every day, meet, meeting with people, mixing with people, mixing with crowds, getting on public transport, getting into cars, you know, it, it really affects me really badly, you know.

And the thing I remember one day when I went to university I walked up to one of the lecturers and basically it was regarding my travel, to renew my travel and for my Freedom pass and a lot of students have to do that. I showed them my Freedom pass and then they go How come you’sve got a Freedom pass? I say Because I’m a disabled student, and they go Where? I can’st see your disability. And I’m like, You know, you don’st need to know where my disability is, and they’sre like, But when I look at you I don’st see you in a wheelchair, I don’st see any disability where, where is your disability? And I really felt shocked, I felt degraded, I thought, you know, who the hell are you to ask me what my disability is, you just, your job is to renew my pass, not to tell me where, and what shocked me is that people are so narrow minded that they choose what is a disability and what is not. For them a disability is someone that needs to be in a wheelchair or someone that needs to, you know, physically needs to be throwing up or whatever. But when you’sve got mental health difficulties it’s like people it’s frowned upon, it’s like. Oh you’sve got mental health difficulty that’s bad, you know, you pose a threat, you know, get away from me. And it really shocks me by the wide, how bad and widespread discrimination is in our society.

I do a lot of work in my community, I’sve been a charity trustee for over twenty different charities, since the age of 16, 17, since the age of 17 I’sve been quite active, been a trustee, been a, I’sve sat on many management committees and I’sve gained the experience as most professionals do in the outside world when they sit, get involved in major decision-making and I’sve experienced all that. and I’sve done quite a lot and I feel that I’sve achieved quite a lot because I’sve been able to bring myself to such a position that when I, when I actually sit down with my university friends, who studied at private schools, you know, I feel far more intelligent than them because in my spare time when they’sre out with their friends I’m reading, I’m studying, I’m working as hard because I know that because of my background, because I didn’st get any GCSEs I need to work as hard. If I don’st then people, when I go to the world of work people will laugh at me, they’sre going to say, you know, you’sve got no GCSEs, you’sve got no formal real qualifications why should we take you on? So I want to work as hard, so far I feel I’sve achieved a lot.

But the thing is that if I were to say excuse me I’m not going to take you because you’sre a white person or you’sre a black person that’s the, you know, they’sll be a, a racist case going on, there’sll be legal disputes out there but if you say, Oh you’sve got a mental health difficulty, who’s going to recognise that? If you go out to people in society, society is so ignorant society will go, Oh they didn’st deserve the job, they’sve got a mental health difficulty, that’s how negatively people see, portray mental health and, you know, race discrimination is recognised and there’s so much huff puff about it but when it comes to discrimination against mental health patients it’s not recognised. That’s why when you talk about it people are like, Huh that’s, you know, why you talking about that, that’s not even important. You know why it’s not important because it’s not recognised. When something is not recognised it’s not important. Racism is important because it’s something we recognise and people always throw allegations of racism. It’s easy to do that, it’s easy to say, you know, I’m a black person so I’m a victim of racism. But if you say I’m a mental health patient people say that’s even worse because you can’st think straight, you don’st know what you’sre talking about etcetera etcetera. So I think that this discrimination, Race Relations Act protects people from race, disability protects people with physical disability.

On occasions it affects the way I learn because people have methods of working and when you take medication it’s sometimes blocks out what you’sve learnt in the last ten hours or eleven hours or if, let’s say I’sve taken medication and I want to get some work done by 12 midnight, it will put you to asleep, it will put you to sleep by within an hour, basically it’s gone, every time I take the medication in the morning it will put you to sleep or completely block everything out and that’s why I tend to take it after 11 o’sclock at night so that I can take it when I go to sleep and when I wake up I’sll be fresh and everything will come back. That’s the thing is that when you take your medication it will block everything out then when you wake up suddenly everything is there again so I tend to take it at night when I’m just about to go sleep and etcetera so yeah.

So what happened during that two years, the bullying was, was so bad, what really stopped me from going to school was in the last nine months, it was an assault that had taken place during a physical education, we call it PE, where I was attacked with a base, with a cricket bat. It wasn’st very hard hit but it was someone had hit me right on my legs and it was, they’sd hit me and the person who was the teacher during the lesson was my form tutor and he was a PE teacher at the school and he did nothing to intervene or stop the violence. And when I did approach him and asked him he said that I was responsible and that if anyone had come to him, if the head teacher had approached him he would say that it was me that assaulted the student. At that point I was amazed that I was being blamed for something I didn’st do but what I did notice is that every time that these bullies were subjecting me to these assaults and every time I did report it nothing was done about it. Nobody was spoken to, no action was ever taken and I was the one that was being held back in detention, I was the one that was being told off, you know, stop making trouble, when I was just coming to school as normal. But then at that period I, because I was young I was vulnerable, I didn’st know what I couldn’st think straight as well I thought to myself, it must be my fault that all these people are bullying me because I must have done this, done something.

But then every night when I went to sleep I started recounting what happened to me during the bullying and everything came flooding back.

And the thing is that even the faces came flooding back, every face, you know, if I was to see all the bullies today I would know their faces. If I was to see all the teachers today I would know their face. It all flooded back, everything flooded back, even the traumatic, the pains that I was going through when I was having my surgery everything all came back. And it, and I couldn’st put it behind me, and it was like when I tried to think of something I couldn’st, it was just right at the front.

I think that no young person should be in a hospital, it’s a very dangerous place for a child, it can be very frightening for a child. children and young people and adults we develop in two different ways, adults are completely different from young people we have different dependency levels and etcetera so I think on that, because in hospitals it’s only those that are eighteen and over mainly or those between thirty and over, the majority of the patients are over twenty five, they’sre usually in their thirties of forties. You wouldn’st put a seventeen year old onto the same ward as a forty year old whose condition is far more worse, who poses a significant threat to all the patients. So it’s better that a child is, is around the people that love them most, their family because that’s where a child should be. And even like every professional I talk to they always say that a child’s home should not be in the hospital it should be in their own home, it should be in the school where they go to school. They shouldn’st be living in a hospital that’s not the place to be.

But to be honest, you know, there’s a lot of talk that, that mental staff are very sort of, they take it to the extreme that they deliberately section people. To be honest at no point was a section considered in my case. My doctors and my nurses were some of the most compassionate, some of the most warm, some of the most kindest people that I’sd ever come across because whenever my, whenever my family brought up sectioning because I, you know, for them it was a new thing that I was unwell and they were quite frightened to have me in the house and stuff, the, the, the doctors were saying no we’sre not going to because we feel that we can’st, we want him to stay in the community because he’s young and we have a lot of, we have, we see a lot out there for him because, and we know that we, he has a future in front of him and we want to treat him at home. and the thing is that over time, over the last four or five, three or four years that I’sve been a patient they’sve seen me gradually recover in front of them and, and they’sve never had to section me. I’sve been supported by them and the thing is that every, in, I, I frequently work closely with my psychiatrists, with my mental health nurse and the thing is a lot of the time staff do and having spoken to other service users the staff do try to impose their own sort of care plan, you know, this is what’s going to happen, this is what you have to take. But for me it was like, you know, what do you want, what do you want us to do, how do you want to go about it?

And they let me set out my own care plan which was amazing so on a weekly basis rather than them telling me what to do, what to take, how to take it, I’sd say look I’m going to take it on this day, I’m going to take it on that day, I’m going to walk, on that day I’m going to go for this, and the thing is they accepted it so it really amazed me that the staff actually listened to what I had to say. but what I did say I sort of, I’m the sort of person that’s sort of, I can be like a politician I can make concessions, I can be like, you know, if you don’st do this then I’m not going to do this. If you don’st let me do this then I’m not going to take the medication etcetera and the thing is that they actually engaged with me in that sort of concession sort of thing. [Laughs] Alright if you do the medication then we’sll do this for you. and it was like, I was able to engage with them frequently and it’s, and until this very day I do, on a monthly basis I go to an outpatients’s appointment to see my psychiatrist and my mental health nurse and we still do make concessions. and like I’m the sort of person that would say, you know, if you don’st make concessions I’m walking out of here, and the thing is that I’sve never had staff not listen to me and they’sve always listened to me etcetera so I think having access to mental health services I’sve actually positively gained out of the support that I’sve received, the support mechanism, you know, they, they’sve been very understanding, whenever I couldn’st come and wouldn’st contact them they’sve been very, you know, We understand.

The people at the hospital decided that the crisis teams that are now everywhere that they come and see me in my home every single day from that day on. So every single day for a very, very long time, I can’st even remember how many months, for every single day for several months they’sd come to see me at home and I’sd tell them this is how I’sve been feeling. But the thing is that even though I was talking to them my condition was worsening and it was worsening. It came to a period where, you know, they couldn’st keep me in the house but what they did do on, on occasions was to put me in the respite unit which we had in the, it was a respite unit that was part of the mental health service, but was in the community and it was a place where people can go and use the services, or use some of the provision that was available such as read books and… And it was away from the outside world, it was, you know, a lot of the time the world is a busy place and people are moving around so it was somewhere where you could go and relax and just have, you know, be with other service users and just enjoy yourself and etcetera. And I spent three or four weeks there and I, I did that frequently so whenever there was tension in the house, whenever I started shouting at people, in my family, that’s when it was decided, you know, you can go there.

And during that summer I actually underwent open heart surgery because I was born with a heart, a serious heart defect and as a result of that I had open heart surgery, heart surgery here in the UK. that was successful but the thing is that any parent will understand how damaging it can be for someone who was about to face surgery was suffering two years of bullying beforehand and I had health problems but these bullies didn’st really care. So I had my surgery, I overcame that and I can’st believe how I did that because I’sd been psychologically damaged from the bullying and now I was moving to another traumatic surgery straight after and I had to spend weeks in hospital because of the surgery. So I believe these two contributed immensely to this, to me psychologically being so damaged if that makes sense.

And the thing is that even the faces came flooding back, every face, you know, if I was to see all the bullies today I would know their faces. If I was to see all the teachers today I would know their face. It all flooded back, everything flooded back, even the traumatic, the pains that I was going through when I was having my surgery everything all came back. And I couldn’st put it behind me, and it was like when I tried to think of something I couldn’st, it was just right at the front.

Okay and so what, what do you think would happen if your community found out, can you say a bit more about that?

Well people would look at you in a negative way, probably ridicule you behind your back, probably make, you know, say things that would be very hurtful if you were there. ridicule you and, and it would be frowned upon, people would think oh my God and it would be spread across relatives and people would be like, He’s got mental health difficulties. And then it may be bad for my own future, for, you know, when I get married and etcetera because, you know, people will say he’s got mental health difficulties, would you want to marry into a family that has someone that has a mental health difficulty etcetera. So I think those are the repercussions of if I came out openly about it.

Do you think that is something that’s particular to, to your community or do you think?

I think it’s particular to certain other communities, BME communities because I think in certain African groups it’s a very sensitive issue as well. in certain, you know, in Indian culture it is regarded, in Bengali culture it is regarded as very sensitive, it’s frowned upon, in Pakistani culture, many different cultures it’s frowned upon. And this is not only talking from me just talking off the top of my head this is from extensive research that has been conducted by universities, that has been conducted by mental health charities, by organisations, by even organisations that tailor their service to ethnic, you know, Indian communities because there are Indian organisations, Indian led organisations that provide services to their own community, mental health services so they have also conducted research and they have found that there is a lot of stigma and a lot, among certain communities in their own. But I think that as people, as an increasing number of people enter the system it will become increasingly accepted by society and that’s when it may be but I don’st think that will be in my lifetime. I think that will take many, many years because I think there is a lot of stigma about still and cultural sensitivity has a lot of influence on people and that’s, I think that, it will take many, many years to defeat.

So what happened during that two years, the bullying was so bad that what really stopped me from going to school was in the last nine months, and it was an assault that had taken place during a physical education, we call it PE, where I was attacked with a base, with a cricket bat. It wasn’st very hard hit but it was someone had hit me right on my legs and it was, they’sd hit me and the person who was the teacher during the lesson was my form tutor and he was a PE teacher at the school and he did nothing to intervene or stop the violence. And when I did approach him and asked him he said that I was responsible and that if anyone had come to him, if the head teacher had approached him he would say that it was me that assaulted the student. At that point I was amazed that I was being blamed for something I didn’st do but what I did notice is that every time that these bullies were subjecting me to these assaults and every time I did report it nothing was done about it. Nobody was spoken to, no action was ever taken and I was the one that was being held back in detention, I was the one that was being told off, you know, stop making trouble, when I was just coming to school as normal. But then at that period I, because I was young I was vulnerable, I didn’st know what I couldn’st think straight as well I thought to myself I, it must be my fault that all these people are bullying me because I must have done this, done something. But I don’st know what I was doing wrong. well I did feel, even what I think what I did do was that I made students feel jealous because I used to come to school and I used to work hard and that really, [pause] if I could put it in this term it really pissed them off that I used to come to school, I used to work hard, go to lessons and I tended to keep to myself, because I was a new student I didn’st tend to mix with anyone else, I’sd rather keep to myself, I’m not there to make friends and my parents were really, you know, pushing me to get good GCSEs etcetera so, and they didn’st like that because they’sre used to being in the big gangs and walk around and I’m not that sort of person. So after that assault in the, during the PE lesson that was the last day I actually went to school and after that I spent six months truanting from school.

I think at a young age you should start teaching, we should start teaching children about these things when they’sre most perceptive, when they’sre able to take, grasp these ideas and views. But I think when we start teaching them when they’sre thirteen, fourteen it’s, it’s a very bad age because at that time they’sre already brainwashed to believe all mental health patients are all crazy, that they all go out and kill people, they all murder people. It’s not how all people, the vast majority of them are law abiding, and I think that recently because I actually gave a talk in the House of Commons on the Mental Health Bill and one politician I think in the press he said, 200 people, or something, 400 people in this country are murdered by mental health patients each year. But then how many people are murdered by non-mental health patients, you know, there are more murders, rapes, kidnaps, assaults, committed by non-mental health patients than mental health patients but why don’st you have a law saying that, you know, put all these people in prison. Well, why not? That means we would put half the population of this country into prison if we had to because when you go out on a Friday and Saturday night a lot of people are violent after drinking a lot etcetera, are we going to put them all in jail? But you seem to want to put people that experience mental health difficulties in jail very quickly so why these double standards? Why? And I think that a lot of these Lords and MPs are brainwashed by what the media tell them. Mental health patients, they’sre going to come and get you, they’sre going to, they’sre out to get the lot of us.

You know, this, this indoctrination of telling people that we’sre all bad, we’sre all negative and that you can’st mix people with people that experience mental health difficulties only contributes to this culture of ignorance and negative, the negative perception people have towards mental health patients and it, and it’s disgraceful and I think that the media can do so much to challenge the stigma but they’sre not being paid billions of pounds to do that. But on the other side they are being paid to generate this negativity and it’s very sad because it puts people like me in a position where we’sre discriminated against. And adding onto that I think that people like me have suffered more, you know, people say that race discrimination is the worst in this country. I think discrimination against mental health patients are far worse but nobody will recognise that because nobody knows about it.