And’ about the differences and, and comparing the recovery but could you say a little bit more about why you think it’s different between having a section with that previously and the vaginal delivery with forceps this time?

Well I think, I think because you, because you’ve had, because you’ve had a section and they send you home and they say don’t do this and don’t do that and, you know, and, and because you’ve got these, you know, these big stitches, well, these big staples and they give you nice strong painkillers to take the edge off it, I think you’re perhaps, or other people as well are probably more aware [baby burping] of the fact that you’ve had quite a traumatic time, whereas a forceps delivery, I think… I mean [husband’s name]’s mum had a forceps delivery and, and so I think probably people who’ve been through it perhaps know a bit more than, you know, but, but when they, I mean, when they send you home and just tell you to take paracetamol and, I mean, it was really, it took really about ten days before I could sit down without thinking about it, kind of thing [slight laugh]. And it really was a lot, a lot more uncomfortable, a lot more painful than I remember it being after [daughter’s name] was born, which is, you know, which is an odd thing but, but, because you would think that sort of, the, you know, the kind of major surgery that a section is, you would think that would be worse, but it really wasn’t.

I think, you know, in the past there was certainly much more of a tendency to treat doctors as, you know, doctors had the final word, and in fact what they said was gospel and, and obviously, you know, doctors were aware of that as well and, and that had an impact on sort of patient care and respect for the patient and stuff like that. I think there is a possibility that in some cases, we go a bit too far the other way and because people get, can get more information, these days as well, and are aware that they can have more information, I think there is a lot more you know, and because the government talks about patient choice and things like that, I think it must be much more difficult to be a doctor now because, although you may think that you know the best thing for your patient, if your patient has other ideas, you’re now duty bound to kind of listen to them and, and to, you know, to take that into consideration. And you may, you may have to do things you don’t agree with because the patient wants you to. But in, in a situation like this where, you know, I think, where people can be very badly, well, where women can be very badly affected by the way that they have their babies, and I think because having a baby is different from having an illness, you know, I mean, you’re, emotionally you’re all over the place before and after and you may not be at your most rational [laughs] and then you’ve got this little person making huge demands on you as well, I think, you know, if you can have the choice and if you can feel that you’re in control of it, I think that probably is, you know, is the best option because I think if you, I think if you’ve, if you have to cope with the idea that you, you know, you wanted things to happen a certain way and they didn’t, you know, you weren’t allowed to have things happen that way, I think that must be quite, that must be quite hard actually.

And what message would you give to health professionals who, who provide the information to women making this decision?

I think to be honest that… I mean, the best thing probably is that, is to be able to spend time discussing it with somebody, if that’s what they want. I mean, that’s probably what’s at the biggest, well, apart from money, I think that’s probably what’s at the highest premium in healthcare is time. You know, time to spend with, with your patients and I think particularly with things like ante-natal clinics where you’re coming in to have your blood pressure done and things like that, theres often a big, you know, theres often a lot of people to get through. Were quite lucky here because theres not that many, you know, it’s not particularly densely populated area, so the midwives are always quite happy to chat to you, but I think you are always aware that theres somebody else in the waiting room, you know, so ‘

And how did you feed her?

I breastfed her.

And that was okay? That wasn’t difficult?

Yeah, no, it was absolutely fine. Again, I mean, she, more because she seemed to know what to do than anything else, but no, I mean, I never really’ she was a bit, she was a bit of a colicky baby, well, not so much colic, but just kind of a bit windy, so we had a few kind of moments with that, but generally speaking she was a very, you know, she still is a very good feeder. And’

Did you feel differently about yourself at all, after the section?

Not really, I don’t think. No, I mean, I think because it’s, it’s such a small scar and you can’t, and it healed very well as well, and so it wasn’t as if I felt that, you know, it wasn’t as if I felt that I had been disfigured by it or anything like that (to baby) No, naughty baby, no. Go and see daddy. But I think because I think I kind of felt that there are so’ I mean, your body is so different after you’ve had a baby anyway’ theres so many things to, that you know, to, to adjust to like having different sized, you know, having different sized boobs and trying to get your stomach back and things like that, that to be honest, it was only one of a number of things, and I, I would say I probably thought about it a lot less than I thought about how much I weighed, for example.

I think my’ sort of my ideal scenario is to’ would be to have a natural birth, you know, this time. I, I really didn’t want, and I don’t want an elective section. I mean, I kind of feel that if, if the same thing happens again, then that’s just it, maybe it’s just, you know, something to do with, with the way that I’m built or something, but, I, I didn’t feel that I wanted to actually arrange to have a, a section. My sister’s getting married’ the baby’s due on [date] and my sister’s getting married on [later date] and I’m technically supposed to be a bridesmaid and there was a bit of pressure initially to have an elective section, particularly when I found out that they tend to do them slightly earlier, so, you know, it might be the week before the sixteenth, but I just felt that that was just a really morally suspect reason for doing it, you know, it was very much a bit like being too posh to push, kind of thing.

And it’s an odd idea, but why, it seems an odd question, but why do you want a natural delivery this time?

I think initially it was because I had… I was under the impression that if I had section this’ if I had another section then that would rule out having any kind of natural delivery and I just didn’t like the idea of removing that element of choice.

I think because I’d been there before I was a bit more confident about what to expect and, because people had, you know, because various doctors or midwives or what-have-you at the ante-natal appointments had made, you know, they’d all looked at the notes and asked me about how, you know, about [daughter’s name] birth. And the doctor, I think it was the consultant who had said’ I’m pretty sure it was the consultant who had said that there was no way that they would let me labour for as long as I’d, you know, he said, ‘We wouldn’t let you labour for as long as you did with your first child anyway’, and I think that was quite significant, because I just, you know, the first time I was there, I was in labour at home the whole day and then I was in labour in the hospital for, you know, nearly twenty-four hours as well before they finally decided that they were going to give me a section.

So, if you think about the information that you’d wanted when you were pregnant the first time, what, what did you want to know?

I can’t remember there being anything specific that I wanted to know, I mean, I think I did what most sort of middle class women do when they get pregnant, which is buy a book and then read it, and then, you know… And I had a, I have a book from – och, one of the big London hospitals, I think it’s published by, and it goes through it week by week and I, I looked at it, you know, every week and sort of checked what was going on. I don’t think I actually read the section on birth. One of my friends who had a baby said not to read it until closer to the time, but I went to ante-natal classes as well, but I don’t think I actually felt that there was anything in particular that I wanted to know. And partly as well, because as soon as you get pregnant, people who have got children start telling you their stories and so, often you have more information than you really need.

I mean, I think, I think the midwives, the community midwives probably asked me about the birth plan and did I have one, but I think because I hadn’t’ I didn’t have any strong feelings about’ I think because I didn’t have any strong feelings about it, I felt that it wasn’t actually a particularly big decision, because I wasn’t, you know, I wasn’t one of these people who sort of said, ‘Oh, no, I definitely want to have a natural delivery and I’m not going to have an epidural and I’m not going to have any, you know, pain relief, I’m just going to breathe through it. I mean, I wasn’t, I wasn’t like that at all. I think my, my kind of feeling about it was that I wanted to, you know, I wanted to have what I think most people want to have, which is a natural delivery without having to have intervention and without having to have sort of lots of pain relief and things like that, but then everyone wants that, everyone wants to be able to just sort of pop the baby out in four hours, but I think at the same time, I was kind of thinking, ‘Well, if it doesn’t work that way then, you know, then it doesn’t work that way.

And did anybody discuss with you at the time the implications of having a section with a first delivery for a future delivery?

I think I’ I think I asked a question about it. I’m pretty sure I did. I can’t remember what it was now [slight laugh]. But I think it was, it was something to do with what, what effect would it have on the future and the doctor who was, I think it must have been a woman, was quite reassuring about it. I mean, I didn’t feel that she pressured me into it at all, because she did say that if we wanted, if I wanted to wait another hour or what-have-you then, that was fine, but she just, she, you know, she didn’t think there was an awful lot of point in it but if I wanted to wait, that was fine.

So’ they, you didn’t have any worries that you would have to have a section again with another delivery or anything?

I. I think I wasn’t very, I wasn’t very sure one way or the other to be honest. I think’ I think that might have been what I asked. I think I might have, I think I might have said, ‘But if I have one now, will I always’ will I have to have another one?’ Because I think I had’ I don’t know if I had it in my head from, you know, reading about people like Victoria Beckham, or what-have-you but, if you have one, you have, you know, you have two or three or whatever. But, I think that was what I’ I know I asked her a question about it and it was definitely to do with the future, because I thought it was quite prescient of me, considering the state I was in by that stage.